Sounds easy. Buy a franchise and you’ll be trained and off you go. There’s more to it than that. Cliff Bramble, founder of Hungry Hospitality, restauranteur, author of several books including, the Business Side of Restaurants, and found of Coursini – an online restaurant industry academy – shares his inside knowledge about what it takes to run a franchise.
[00:00:30] – Intro [00:02:30] – About Cliff [00:04:24] – Marketing a Franchise [00:09:18] – Business Structure and Systems [00:09:42] – Basic Tips on Better Bookkeeping [00:17:38] – Budgeting, Scheduling, and Forecasting [00:18:59] – Hiring the Right People [00:20:45] – Training and Caring for Employees [00:25:06] – Hiring in Non-Conventional Ways [00:28:47] – About Coursini and Cliff’s Upcoming Book [00:31:04] – Closing
“The consistency is key because it is part of training and honestly, part of the reason why I came up with some of these courses is the consistent training. If you hire somebody, and you continuously have turnover, you have to ask the question, is it you, or is it the person training? It’s a consistent message that will keep people employed and hopefully excited about their job.”
Cliff Bramble
Podcast Transcript
[00:00:30] Karl: Welcome to the Capitalist Sage Podcast. We’re here to bring you advice and tips from seasoned pros and experts to help you improve your business. I’m Karl Barham with Transworld Business Advisors, and my co-host is Rico Figliolini with Mighty Rockets Digital Marketing, and he is the publisher of the Peachtree Corner Magazine. Hey Rico, how are you doing today?
[00:00:48] Rico: Hey Karl, great. It’s been a beautiful, sort of a beautiful week. I mean, we’ve had some storms. We’re going to end up in the freeze zone soon, I think. But glad that we’re back on track with the Capitalist Sage with a great guest today. But before we get to that, I just want to mention our sponsor is Peachtree Corners Magazine. The sponsor of the family of podcasts that we do this one, including Peachtree Corners Life and Prime Lunchtime with the City Manager. So check those out. You can find those podcasts anywhere you listen to podcasts, on iHeartRadio, Spotify, and others. Or watch the video podcast on YouTube or our Facebook page.
[00:01:26] Karl: Excellent. Well, Rico, this is our fourth year now. We are starting our fourth year doing the Capitalist Sage and providing information to folks here in Georgia and Peachtree Corners area, as well as out there in the internet world. Just talking business with local business owners and folks that share some of their wisdom and knowledge and experience with our audience. Today, it is my privilege to introduce a return guest, Mr. Cliff Bramble, a local Peachtree Corner resident. And he’s also the founder of Hungry Hospitality, LLC. He’s a local business owner and an author of several books on business and restaurants and many other things. And today we’re going to get a chance to talk about some of the success secrets of operating successful food franchise businesses, and some of the tools that people should be considering and thinking about in 2022 to make their business better, stronger, more resilient than ever. Cliff, how are you doing today?
[00:02:26] Cliff: Fantastic, Karl, thank you very much for having me on. I really appreciate it.
[00:02:30] Karl: Oh, our pleasure. Why don’t we start off, tell a little bit about your history. Folks that may not know you, tell you a little bit about your background and some of the stuff that you’ve done.
[00:02:39] Cliff: Well, I don’t want to go too far back, it’ll make me look like I’m really old. So I’m just going to start with the last like 20 years. But in the last 20 years, I previously owned Noble Fin here in Peachtree Corners. And unfortunately COVID really shut me down pretty quickly over there. But before that I was a co-founder of Rathbun’s restaurant from 2004 a ll the way until 2020. So that’s about 17 years over there. And it was a great ride. We opened up Rathbun’s, Kevin Rathbun Steak, Krog Bar, KR Steak Bar. And then before that I worked for Buckhead Life Restaurant Group in Buckhead in a place called Nava that was happening for many years. And I’ve owned a couple other businesses before that. And then I was in California before that opening up hotels in Southern California. All the tough parts, La Jolla, San Diego, Rancho Mirage, Palm Desert. You know, it was all the tough parts.
[00:03:30] Karl: I hear you. Well, we got you back here in Georgia now, and we’re really grateful for that. Why don’t we jump in on this topic that we wanted to chat about. When I talk to business owners all the time, there’s a large amount of folks that own and operate franchises. One of the most amazing things to me, franchise is a great opportunity for those that want an established structure and brand that they can focus on executing and operating a business, and they don’t have to think of everything from scratch. But one of the key components to success is really just the fundamentals of operating a business and especially a restaurant or a food based business. And so I’m wondering if we could talk a little bit about some of the things you’ve learned in running, especially a restaurant food business that you think a lot of franchise folks don’t really get about being successful. Anything that comes to mind to start?
[00:04:24] Cliff: Well, the first one would be the marketing. Simply because I have had one or two franchise clients over the years, and the marketing is always the most important factor, especially when it comes down to individual owners owning a franchise. So I say marketing is always the first one.
[00:04:44] Karl: Absolutely. Well, let’s talk about marketing for a little bit before we jump to the next one. Most franchises, one of their selling points is we help you with marketing and there’s, whether it’s national campaigns going on or they might provide marketing materials and signage and logos and so on. What are some of the things that you think as an individual local business owner, they should be focusing on and investing in marketing? Why don’t we start about with how much would you recommend people invest? How much of their revenue, or do you have any ideas around that? And then what specific things they could be doing?
[00:05:17] Cliff: Well, yeah, there’s a little percentage wise that people have spoken about over the years saying 1% of your sales really goes to marketing or advertising. I say marketing rather than advertising. But for the local people, the most important part of the franchise and especially being a local franchise. I have not been one, but as far as somebody being in the local, is really knowing your surroundings. And now people can spend a lot of money on marketing, but if they’re doing social media and they’re collecting people’s information. For example, if they are restaurant, and even if it’s a small bread company, for example, or a small little sandwich place. Everybody who’s walking in, if they can get their customer email and their phone number and know them, you know what having that as a social media base and a direct marketing so they can send people information is a huge benefit.
[00:06:07] Karl: When I think about businesses, especially when we look at selling a business, we typically talk about their marketing strategy they do. Something that’s appearing more and more now, they talk about the number of followers, their digital marketing there. So, as an actual asset, it’s not something you can touch and feel, but it is an asset in the business that can be quantified. And what you’re talking about, capturing their information, getting them to follow them on social media, can actually have value beyond just generating more sales.
[00:06:38] Cliff: There’s no question about it. And I’m just finishing up a book called the Marketing Side of Restaurants. And I will tell you, one of the areas in there, one of the chapters is specifically on this. And the reason I say this is because there was somebody who, a client that I had previously, it was a hair salon. And I’ll give a quick example, the hair salon, they were wondering why they were having problems. Number one, they weren’t making enough money. That was the first problem. So I said, all right, let me come in and check it out. And as I looked at everything, I said, okay what do you want to do? And their response was, we want to close this and we want to move up to another place and it’s up the street, because it’s a better location. So ultimately I said alright, where is your database of all your individuals, all your clients? We don’t have a database. All we have are first names and we have some people’s phone numbers. So my response was well, if you move, how are your customers all going to know where you moved? You know, so, in a matter of a very quick time, because they had so many people’s phone numbers, they ended up getting people’s names, numbers, using them on Facebook, using them on Constant Contact, even MailChimp. And it really helped them tremendously.
[00:07:45] Rico: Are you finding anything different over the last year or so with marketing because of COVID even? Has any new innovations happened over the last year or two?
[00:07:54] Cliff: Well yeah, there’s a lot of innovation, especially for the restaurants. You know, for example, when you go and pay at the table now, and a lot of people hand you a little handheld, you can actually punch in your email into some of those as a loyalty program. So the loyalty programs are very good to have, especially on a smaller franchise. Because the loyalty, people feel like they’re getting something out of that too, rather than just writing down an email. But the loyalty side is a good factor. And that has come in, into full force right now.
[00:08:22] Karl: I know the top line of revenue is always important and franchise owners very often will just a hundred percent depend on the franchise to do their marketing. If I’m hearing you right, doing your own marketing and development, they don’t help you with all of it. They may give you the tools, but if you don’t use them, you’re not really going to get the benefit.
[00:08:42] Cliff: Well, you know, it goes back to that whole, you can lead a horse to water, but you can’t make them drink. Somebody told me many years ago, if you have a guest in your restaurant, and if you call them by their name seven times within that time that they’re there, they will be back within a week. And that’s a huge factor of getting to know the people. And I know, a lot of franchises will pay the 4 or 5, 6% every single week or every month, depending on how they have it set up. But knowing the local market is very important too. And I think that as the smaller franchisors work in their area, they know their customers rather than the franchisee who may be six states away.
[00:09:18] Karl: So after marketing, what would you say would be the second thing that you see franchise owners of food businesses missing when they’re going out there and trying to be successful?
[00:09:29] Cliff: Well, a lot of it has to do with the structure. People have to have structure in their business and that goes with any area. So they have to have structure of the invoices coming in. They have to have a system and having those systems in place are highly important.
[00:09:42] Karl: You’re absolutely right. Let’s expound a little bit more on the systems that people have. There’s a management of kind of cash and making sure that it’s accurate your financial systems in there. Anything that you think, tips that you’ve learned along the way that helped you to be successful in understanding money coming in and out?
[00:10:02] Cliff: Absolutely. Number one is the first part is the invoicing, because if you don’t have a system on your invoicing those invoices come in, they come in every single day. If you don’t have a system, the invoice comes in, it goes to the invoice box, it gets checked, it gets designated to a special account. And then it gets logged into the chart of accounts into the computer, the accounting program, and then it gets filed. If you don’t have that set up, you’re just going to have a problem because at the end of the month, you might think that you did fantastic. But you may be missing five or six invoices. Knowing that is in my opinion, highly important. And having somebody in the bookkeeping side know about that area is very important too.
[00:10:39] Karl: Well, let’s talk about bookkeeping because that is one huge pet peeve of mine. Oh boy. When you think about a business, I always equate accounting and bookkeeping to your scorecard. So if the data that’s going in is wrong and there isn’t attention to it, what it’s producing for you to be able to make decisions is going to be flawed at best and possibly cause you to fail ultimately. Why is it that so many people have struggled with this bookkeeping stuff?
[00:11:07] Cliff: I honestly, I think sometimes they’re afraid of it, you know. But you’re always afraid of what you don’t know. They always say if you know something, you’re always going to go back to it. So if you were promoted to a chef, but you were first a general manager, you’ll always be able to go back to that general manager. But when you really break it down in the accounting side and bookkeeping, there’s really only three areas that you have to look at all the time. You have to look at your general ledger because whoever’s punching that information in, if they are punching it in the wrong code, for example, it’ll show up on the general ledger. So in addition to that, they also have to look at their income statement and they have to pay attention too, and not just look at the top sales line and the bottom profit or loss. And hopefully it’s a profit. Maybe there’s a fear of tackling it, but only taking five minutes every single month to look at this information, isn’t really enough. You have to look at your balance sheet. You have to look at your general ledger and you have to look at your income statement. But you have to be excited about it too. And there’s not enough people who are excited about numbers, unless they’re making money.
[00:12:10] Rico: Let me ask you something, between industries too is it a little different, little easier bookkeeping? For example, restaurants, point of purchase sales. It’s coming in on the iPad or whatever you’re taking it in on. So it’s going straight to your bookkeeping at some point, right? Automatically.
[00:12:25] Cliff: It goes straight to the point of sale system. So the income goes to the point of sale system. So you can just run a report every single night. But if you own a hair salon, the same exact thing goes. There’s somebody who’s punching in the sale every day. At the end of every day, they run a report on the point of sales. The key to that Karl, is closing out your sales, every single day. You have to do it. If you don’t do it, you’re just going to run into a problem.
[00:12:49] Karl: Isn’t it similar to the analogy of if you have a closet or a room in the house and you don’t clean it every week, and then at the end of the year, you’ve got to go in and clean all of that. That’s kind of how some people run their bookkeeping. They wait until the end of the year they had invoices. They had expenses that have come in, in February. And it has PFL or something. They don’t know what it is. They end up with large miscellaneous expenses because they didn’t track it. But I think your key point, there is a combination of knowledge which can be learned. Talk to us a little bit about how can people get better at basic, you don’t have to be an expert. What are some things that can help them get better at learning how to read enough financial statements so they can run their business successfully?
[00:13:36] Cliff: It’s interesting that you ask that because I just started something called Coursini, which is a, it’s geared to franchises. There’s a whole page that’s geared to franchises as well, but basically they’re online courses and they’re courses on balance sheets. There’s courses on general ledger, it’s really simple information. And these courses, for example, they’re available online. You can take them for 10 minutes, 20 minutes at a time. You can take them on an airplane. But the nice part is, you’re learning something about it. You can read from a book. But I will tell you, in my opinion, the courses are really good. The courses are good and one more thing I want to mention about this is that on a weekly basis, the franchisees or whoever it is running their business, they should have a cashflow statement printed pretty much every single Friday. That will help them a lot. And you know what? It may make them more interested in those reports.
[00:14:24] Rico: As far as the bookkeeping part goes, because I do my own invoicing. But I have a bookkeeper that comes behind me. So every month she’ll spend two or three hours a month to make sure she cleans up whatever I’m doing. And to prep the file, so this way we don’t have that problem at the end of the year, at the end of the quarter. And I use QuickBooks, I can go on my app on my phone. I can see what my balances are. I can see what my costs are. I could look and pull reports right off my phone. And I’m sure even the point of purchase stuff can be integrated into a QuickBooks or some system like that. Where it just comes straight across and it doesn’t take a rocket scientist to do some of that. Right. I mean, is that?
[00:15:02] Karl: Absolutely. I know ways that people can get their bookkeeping pass down to 15 minutes a month if they set up their chart of accounts. And if you don’t know what a chart of accounts is, you need to learn something, take a course or get a book. The general ledger, once you set up your chart of accounts, you can with Quickbooks Online, and some of the other tools that are NetSuite and others, you can automate probably 90% of the transactions in there. Once it’s set up, you go in and you check to make sure that the numbers are right and so on. And it simplifies the bookkeeping. The other part is a regular cadence, weekly or monthly reviews of it. Whether it’s your bookkeeper that you outsource, whether you do it yourself, allocate an hour to go through that. And there’s the old saying of balancing checkbooks. Nobody does that anymore. Well, each month you should balance out your QuickBooks for the month to make sure you have a P and L statement that’s accurate to reflect that month, the profit and loss statement. But these systems are some of the core things, if you’re in a business, it is your scorecard. And just investing more time, money, resources, to get competent enough to know whether your accountant or bookkeeper is doing it right, is really important to success.
[00:16:18] Cliff: You know, as a business owner, I’m going to tell you this you, you mentioned it right on. The bookkeepers, they’re great. They are doing what they’re doing. The accountants are doing what they’re doing, but you know what, they’re only as good as what the information is that you give to them. So I always say double check your accountant. Because they’re going to appreciate it, and you are too. You may not be able to double check the depreciation side, but at the same time, you can check everything else from the charter, from the general ledger. That general ledger there is your best friend. And if everybody looks at that at least once a month, the information gets punched in from the bookkeeper or the owner of the business. They just have to pay attention to it.
[00:16:57] Karl: And this is an area that franchises don’t cover. When you go on franchise training for two weeks, they do not go into detail on bookkeeping. They say, you have to do that on your own. So finding other courses, resources to get yourself educated is key. Even if you choose not to do it yourself, you should at least understand what a general ledger is, what it looks like. The cash flow statement, balance sheet, and a P and L statement. If you know what those four things then, and the general ledger, you’re in good shape. Let’s go on with structure a little bit more. Let’s talk about the people side. What kind of structures do you see being really important for people to master in running a franchise food business?
[00:17:38] Cliff: Well, the structures, they have to have the budgeting. They have to know about the scheduling. And they have to deal with the forecasting as well. So that’s one area, I say that’s one area all together. There’s three areas in one. If they’re creating a structure with their budgeting and they’re doing the same thing every single week. Every Friday they get their cashflow, every Monday they maybe send out all their checks. And they’re doing the schedules every single week and the schedules are based on their sales. So the sales go back to the budget. It all kind of works all hand in hand.
[00:18:07] Karl: This is the key thing. I think what you’re describing, I typically call a planning function. And if you want to have a predictable output, it always starts with a plan. I’d hate to try to build a house kind of ad hoc. Usually people would sketch out the bathroom should go here and the kitchen should go here and they build it from what’s in the wall first. And then they finish it at the end. With a business, having a plan of knowing what you’re going into, how much labor you’re going to need, what’s your material costs. So each week you can compare it to what you planned, some target. If you typically spend $5,000 a week on food. At the end of the week, you check if you’re 3000, you did better. If you’re 7,000, you want to know why. If you start getting multiple weeks of that, you can make an adjustment or a correction before the end of the month where you now have to register a loss.
[00:18:57] Cliff: Bingo. That’s exactly right.
[00:18:59] Karl: These are critical things. What about on the people side? Hiring, onboarding. I’ve seen franchises give you some guidance of how to hire people, but I don’t know if they do as good a job on how do you onboard people and train them. Especially in the food business where turnover tends to be higher than some other businesses.
[00:19:18] Cliff: Exactly. Well, you know, when it comes down to the hiring. Again, you have to have a system in hiring. Right now, the system for hiring is people just looking for people. They need bodies. And, but at the same time, there’s a lot of people hiring and you’ve got to hire the right person. Because if you hire the wrong person, there’s a saying out there it’s easier to hire somebody, it’s tough to fire them. And in Georgia, that might be a little different as a right to work state. But you want to hire the right people and you want to interview the right way as well. And somebody came up to me the other day and I said, oh, how was your interview? They said, boy, I couldn’t get a word in. And I said really? That’s interesting. I said, you couldn’t get the word in. And uh, you know, I said, it’s supposed to be the other way. So when you hear that, it’s important to hire the right people, make sure they have the right skill set. And also, you know, once they’re on board, make sure you’re training them the right way. And that goes back to the structure as well. Because if you’re not training them and you’re just handing them a key and you’re saying, okay, this is what you do. You know what, those first five days, that new employee is going to make up their mind whether they’re going to stay or whether they’re going to go.
[00:20:19] Rico: The idea that you were saying, it’s easier to hire than fire. When you hired the wrong person that team member poisons the rest of the team. You know? So, that’s one. And that’s hard to reverse. And then the other side of that is, especially in the food business I’ve got to believe, the chef may be doing a great job, but because that server brought it out badly and didn’t get it to you the right way, you might have a bad experience, right?
[00:20:45] Cliff: Yeah, you’re absolutely right. And part of the training, and I mentioned this before in my courses online on Coursini, I can tell you that one of them is human resources. One of the courses is human resources, and I had to break it down into five parts simply because of the fact of, there’s one on hiring. There’s one on payroll. There’s one on taking care of the employees. You have to take care of the employees. You have to train them, you have to care for them, you have to have some empathy these days. There’s a lot of variables that are going into what’s hiring and Rico, you asked earlier what’s changed? You know, the hiring has changed too. Because when people show up and they have a mask on, you don’t really know what to do. It’s a little, it feels weird. And then you say, okay, they see you without a mask and they ask you, is it okay if I take my mask off? And so right there, the, you have to have something that kind of lets the casualness come back and feel a little more comfortable because it is a little odd these days.
[00:21:38] Rico: Yeah. That can be interesting, interviewing someone wearing a mask. You never see their face.
[00:21:47] Karl: It is, but I think you’re highlighting something there, Cliff. The owner of the business and most small businesses franchise are operator owned. And they set the tone for the business. So if you have a mask policy and the owner or the manager, doesn’t wear a mask, it’s really hard to get other people to follow it. They’re going to follow the lead of the leader. The other part of that is, is you talked about the five sections of kind of, training around employees. There are some laws out there you’ve gotta be familiar with so that you don’t cross the wrong line. And franchises often don’t cover that in training because every state laws are different. So knowing how to handle unemployment, workers’ comp, how to handle harassment issues and protect yourself, making sure you’re covering labor laws, overtime. There’s a whole bevy of laws that you need to be aware of. You don’t have to be a master of, but you need to be aware of, and you need to let your managers know, and your employees know these specific things. If you’re going to have employees in your business.
[00:22:48] Cliff: The other big part about that, Karl, is right now with so many people working from their home and a lot of people have just said, okay I might be employed in Georgia, but I’m going to go travel. They’ve given up the house. And next thing you know, they’re living somewhere else. So what you have all of a sudden, you have to sit back and say, okay wait a minute. They’re living somewhere else, do I pay payroll taxes in Georgia? Or do I pay it in Texas? Where do I actually pay them? So then they’re going to, sometimes it’s easier to look at, there’s a PEI company where you can actually start looking at hiring people under something else rather than yours. But these days, Rico again, to your point earlier, what’s changed. For a lot of companies and I don’t know how many franchises have individuals who work either out of their office or out of state. But they have to look at and make sure they’re paying people the right payroll tax per state code as well.
[00:23:35] Karl: Absolutely. The other aspect is values of the business. Rico talking about service and so on. If that’s important in your business, clearly articulating the values and service expectations consistently with the employee base is critical. And if you’re suffering from turnover where every, three to six months, you’re bringing on new people, you need a system in place to constantly train and retrain those people. And it’s gotta be something that’s on demand and that’s accessible, et cetera for that. So these are some of the things, investments, that people should be considering in 2022 if they really want to start seeing major shifts in performance in their business.
[00:24:20] Cliff: Well, the consistency is key because part of training and honestly, part of the reason why I came up with some of these courses is the consistent training. If you have, and I’ll give you a good case. If you hire somebody, and you continuously have turnover, you have to ask the question, is it you, or is it the person training? In addition to that as an independent for example, if you’re a franchisee or franchise and you’re doing the training, that’s great. But what happens when you step away? Is somebody training them the same exact way, and there’s no way for you to quantify that or unless you’re having tests and you have a structure. But the on demand courses that are out there right now, and especially what I’m doing with the Coursini, it makes it easy. And it’s consistent and it’s a consistent message that will keep people employed and hopefully excited about their job.
[00:25:06] Karl: I’ve seen some of these systems, people could invest in under $10,000 a year under $20,000 a year, yet avoid much higher costs from either non-compliance or not being able to cover all the topics because managers are doing three or four jobs at a time. There’s a lot of hidden costs in not addressing this training slash putting these systems in place for their business. So it’s definitely something folks should think about and consider going forward. Since COVID has changed the nature of work. And when we’re seeing this shortage of workers and all these other types of things impacting franchise, is there any tips you could share with recruiting and hiring how to find people in non-conventional ways? I understand ZipRecruiter and Indeed, and everything could be done online. But sometimes you find the best people through your networks elsewhere. What are some of the things people could invest in to help with that?
[00:26:08] Cliff: There’s a million different ones online. There’s a few, there’s one I won’t even mention the name, but I know if I put something on there, I’ll get a hundred resumes from a hundred different states in all different countries. And so you want the right one. But the one area that works the best is the employees that are working there. Ask them for their friends, because people like to work with people that they know. And they’re not going to bring in somebody who’s a slacker, for example. They want to work with people who are actually good people. So in my opinion, asking those individuals if they could recommend any friends, is a very important aspect of maintaining, retaining your employees. It has to be people who are good and they want to work with each other. But when you start looking elsewhere, I always say this, you’ve got a 50-50 shot when you’re hiring somebody from the outside. You’ve pretty much almost got a hundred percent shot when you’re hiring somebody, who’s a friend of somebody who works there. But more importantly, you have to take care of all the employees. You can’t go to your employees if you’re just not the best manager. And you’re always asking them to bring people in, because they’re going to say well, I don’t know if my friend’s going to want to work with the person. Treating the employees and hiring, they all go hand in hand. You have to take care of the people.
[00:27:20] Rico: It almost sounds like, if you’re getting it from a team member they’re invested in that team. Cause you don’t want, talking about before, you don’t want someone that’s going to be a slacker, let’s say. And then everyone’s looking at that one person saying we’re doing and all the work he’s like always taking a 10 minute break doing something else. But yeah, no. That makes a lot of sense. I’ve found that referrals from personal people makes a lot more sense.
[00:27:41] Karl: And in our business, we actually pay for referrals. So if one of the team members refers somebody successfully, we pay referral bonuses for folks and as part of that. But I think you’re hitting on the key point. The work that needs to be done first is making sure that you’re an environment that people want to refer into. Think about it this way, if your own employees are not excited to refer people to come work with them, what you’re looking at is probably employees that are at risk to leave. If they’re getting feedback, there was a time where people used to get employee surveys or feedback. You don’t have to hire a fancy company to get feedback, have lunch with your employees, ask them how things are going, ask them their opinion, ask them how you can improve and how the business can improve. Or you can do a survey yourself, but get the feedback so you could improve the things that might be poisoning some folks in that work environment. It could be a manager that you love, but treats everybody else terribly. You need to get that feedback, that 360 feedback, to help address those.
[00:28:46] Cliff: Great points. Absolutely.
[00:28:47] Karl: Listen, Cliff, I really appreciate some of the insight that you shared with us today. I do realize that when you’re operating food businesses, it’s already challenging with very slim margins. You get some help with a franchise, owning a franchise. But we wanted to make sure people realize whether you own one today or you’re thinking of owning one in the future. There’s gaps in the information that you get from the franchise. Not intentionally, they just can’t cover everything. And supplementing that with whatever resources, investment, and time and money to help train yourself and your managers and your team. And Cliff, some of the work you’re doing and sharing out there and what you’ve developed and what other people have developed is really helping to hit that. Why don’t you tell us a little bit more about Coursini and the franchise course that you developed? And share how can people find out more.
[00:29:39] Cliff: So they can go to Coursini.Com It’s a C-O-U-R-S-I-N-I.com. It’s really made of mini courses. That’s really how I came up with the name. It sounds like it’s Italian, but I don’t think it is. Basically there on the franchise side, there’s a franchise about 40 different courses in there from finance to marketing, to hiring individuals, to running a business, starting the business. I mean, there’s a lot of stuff in there and so we’ve made them really reasonable on a subscription basis. In addition to that, I’m just finishing this book. It’s called the Marketing Side of Restaurants. This is the last of the two of the series. The other one was the Business Side of Restaurants. This one here is a, it’s a less than a hundred pages. And you know what, it’s all on marketing. There’s so much information in here. And part of it, was again, I go back to the franchise or any restaurant or any small business owner. There’s so many individuals that have a tough time marketing. And this book really tells them what they need to do on a pretty much social media basis, on a publicist basis and also a collection of people’s information so that they can actually get to know their people, the customers a lot more. So it’s a good thing, you know, and the goal is online courses, 24/7, on demand. And through the Coursini classes, I mean, you could be on the beach and taking these courses. And the feedback that I’ve received from the individuals who have taken the courses has been really great. So there’s videos in there, there’s tests in there, there’s all kinds of information and we’re excited to get it going.
[00:31:04] Karl: Excellent. I’m glad that we have someone here in Peachtree Corners that’s helping to share some of the knowledge that they have and more importantly, help serve the business community. If you own a small local franchise or a business, and you have a gap in training and getting information to folks, please do check out and support Cliff here in the community, as well as really look at it for your own self. How are you investing in you and your team to be better in 2022? You’ve survived the pandemic, at least the bulk of it. Now it’s time to thrive in your business. So, we want to thank Cliff Bramble, founder of Hungry Hospitality, LLC. And we want to thank you for your insights and sharing your experience with us once again.
[00:31:46] Cliff: Thank you very much for having me.
[00:31:48] Karl: Our pleasure. Well, today I just want to say Rico and I are glad to be starting off our fourth year doing the Capitalist Sage Podcast. I’m Karl Barham with Transworld Business Advisors of Atlanta Peachtree. Our business advisors are available to help consult on your business, whether you’re looking to improve it, grow it, and exit your business. We consult on your business, help you with evaluation, but really help you with your plan for the future. We kind of think of ourselves as a form of retirement advisor for business owners. One day you may want to step away from the business and having a plan in place and a resource in the community here that can help you with the sale of your business or acquiring a business. It’s just part of the strategy for success. So reach out to us at www.TWorld.com/AtlantaPeachtree. Or you could email me Karl Barham KBarham@TWorld.com. And I’d love to set up a consult with you to talk through any issues you might be having in your business. Rico, why don’t you tell us a little bit about what you’ve got going on?
[00:32:48] Rico: Sure. First, I want to say thank you to Cliff again for being on the show. I always learn a lot from Cliff. It’s amazing. No really, truly, I’m serious. And Karl too, because I learn a lot from you too. And I wish I was in the restaurant business, crazy, but yes. I’m happy where I am. So I’m good in publication.
[00:33:14] Cliff: You could get a job though. There’s a lot of people looking for restaurant people right now, I’ve heard.
[00:33:20] Rico: Yeah. Yes. I could do that $15 an hour job. At least they raised the wage a little bit, so that’s helpful.
[00:33:26] Karl: They have.
[00:33:26] Cliff: Don’t be fooled, they make more than that.
[00:33:29] Rico: Yes, I know with the tips and everything. But I’m glad where I am. I publish Peachtree Corners Magazine, and that’s fine for me right now. In fact, I’m looking at launching a second publication. I will have more news about that in a month or so. But besides that I do Mighty Rockets, which is a digital marketing company. So if you’re looking for video production, photography, content, Social media management. You could reach out to me, just find me on LinkedIn. It’s Rico Figliolini. And that’s easy to spell if you know how to spell it, F-I-G-L-I-O-L-I-N-I. I’m one of maybe two or three on there. So it’s easy enough to find me. The other one would be my brother and he’s in Canada. So you can’t use him. He’s not in this business. I’m excited because we’re working on the next issue. We’ve just put out our largest, 88 page issue just this month. Actually beginning of December, we’re working on a next issue right now, which is the best of Peachtree Corners and Reader’s Choice Award. So we’re in the midst of a survey right now. And so far within a week, we’ve had over 400 respondents on it. It’s going to be a nice.
[00:34:31] Karl: Rico, why don’t you tell us how do people access the survey? Where can they find it?
[00:34:35] Rico: Sure. So if you go onto LivingInPeachtreeCorners.com, you’ll scroll down just a little bit and you’ll see a graphic that says Reader’s Choice Award Survey, and you can take that survey there. And five of those that actually participate in this, will get a $75 cash Visa gift card later, drawn at random. So this way, some incentive for coming in. Give your opinion of best restaurants, summer camps. I could have made this a really long survey. So I, but I didn’t. I kept it down to a certain categories. But do that. And the next thing that we’re actually launching right now, and I just posted it online is Faces of Peachtree Corners. So we’re going to choose 20 people, from 12 and up that have a great story to tell what they’ve done, giving back to the community and all that. So check that out also, and nominate someone if you think they’re worthy enough to be there. But that’s where I’m at and this is always a great conversation to have.
[00:35:28] Karl: As I’ve been driving around too, just a heads up for folks, I notice a lot of the local schools are having open houses over the next couple of weeks. I think Wesleyan and Cornerstone, if you’ve got young kids looking for schools, it’s that time of year where people are starting to think about schools for next year, next season. So check out online and all the local schools are having their open houses right now. Greater Atlanta Christian and all the other private schools and public schools. Go check them out.
[00:35:56] Rico: Amazing how many schools serve this area that aren’t even in Peachtree Corners. Woodward academy, there’s a bunch of places, Brandon Hall. So Wesleyan obviously. Greater Atlanta Christian, Cornerstone, of the private schools anyway.
[00:36:08] Karl: Absolutely. Well, we want to thank everybody again. Tune in, we have a great schedule of guest speakers and guests for the show for this year. We’re going to keep doing this and sharing, talking about business. It’s kind like inside baseball, inside business for Peachtree Corners and surrounding areas. So thanks everybody for your support and look forward to talking to you.
As we look back at 2024, there were a number of acquisitions, new businesses opening, major renovations and milestones celebrated. I’ll attempt to highlight some of them, knowing that I can’t possibly cover them all. There were some new events this year too.
This past year was a big one for Guardian Sports, a Peachtree Corners company that designs and manufactures helmet covers. The NFL now requires Guardian Caps be worn during NFL during practice, and players may choose to wear them during games. The caps disperse energy during hits with the goal of reducing head injuries.
Insight Sourcing of Peachtree Corners was acquired by Accenture, a leading global professional services company. Insight Sourcing helps clients optimize costs when sourcing and negotiating contracts for materials, services related to capital expenditures and energy procurement management. Accenture is a talent- and innovation-led company with approximately 743,000 people serving clients in more than 120 countries.
Axon, the global leader in connected public safety technologies, acquired Fusus, a leader in real-time crime center technology located in Peachtree Corners. Fusus excels in aggregating live video, data and sensor feeds from virtually any source, enhancing situational awareness and investigative capabilities for public safety, education and commercial customers.
Milestone celebrations
Authentic Hardwood Flooring on Amwiler Road celebrated 25 years in business in 2024. Michael Keroack has been steadily growing the operation for roughly eight years in Peachtree Corners with the help of Buddy Wofford, general sales manager, and Michael Blocker, director of operations.
Also celebrating a milestone in 2024 was Diversified Resource Group (DRG). For nearly 25 years, Darrell Creedon has been running DRG in Peachtree Corners, outfitting workspaces for companies and governments, and more recently, hotels and convention centers. Mr. Creedon, who resides in Peachtree Corners, started the furniture business with a college friend in 1999 in a home basement.
City events
The City of Peachtree Corners organized the 2nd Annual Curiosity Lab Criterium in April. This year’s event featured a running race, kids races, food trucks, vendors and other activities for the family. There was also a fun run in Technology Park. Werfen, a global diagnostics company, and the City of Peachtree Corners, partnered on a 5K Walk/Run in Technology Park in November. The event benefitted the Leukemia & Lymphoma Society. In May, the city organized a food truck event at Curiosity Lab, which drew about 210 people working in and around Technology Park.
ThePCBA organized the first Taste of Peachtree Corners in June. It was a great time of networking and community fellowship among business owners and other involved citizens. Approximately 100 people experienced an evening of delicious bites and drinks, sampling foods from local businesses.
New to the city
Blue River Development moved its corporate office from Forsyth County to Peachtree Corners to expand its operations. The company is a leader in real estate development and investment.
A former steel pipe fabrication site at 6420 Corley Road that was converted to a logistics center is now fully leased. The 27-acre property, which sold for $10.5 million in 2018 was sold for $77.4 million three years later, after it was cleaned up and redeveloped into the Peachtree Corners Logistics Center.
The Central Business District
Also in May, the city adopted a 6-month moratorium on projects in the Central Business District. Due to the increasing number of applications and evolving market trends, the moratorium came into effect on May 3 and ended on November 3. The moratorium gave the city six months to pause rezoning applications, special use permits and variances applications for residential or mixed-use development.
In August, members of the Peachtree Corners City Council took part in a ribbon cutting at The Forum. We celebrated the opening of the new plaza and activity areas. Jamestown is modernizing the 20-year-old Forum shopping center and transforming it into a true mixed-use destination through the addition of a 125-room boutique hotel, approximately 381 multifamily units, new experiential retail and dining offerings, structured parking and an expanded public area.
Construction began in May 2023, and the first of two new greenspace additions were constructed. Phases II and III will see the multifamily and boutique hotel constructed, both slated to start in 2025. Also this year, it was announced that Jamestown, a global real estate investment and management firm, acquired the Cincinnati-based North American Properties, which owned The Forum.
Members of the Peachtree Corners Redevelopment Authority and Downtown Development Authority engaged in a focus group discussion in August at City Hall. The discussion was led by representatives from Kimley-Horn, engineering, planning and design consultants. There was discussion about under-utilized spaces, needed amenities and potential uses for vacant properties. City officials also met with members of the commercial real estate community in September to specifically discuss Technology Park.
International visitors, co-working and new townhome project
An 18-member delegation of Finnish business people visited Curiosity Lab in Peachtree Corners in September. The visit marks the second time a Finnish delegation has visited Peachtree Corners. Seven innovative Finnish companies traveled to the Atlanta area in search of U.S. partners to promote transatlantic trade between Finland and the United States. Japanese delegates involved in sectors such as automotive, technology, energy and corporate development also visited Peachtree Corners in December as part of a regional tour.
Construction of a co-working space, Roam, is well underway at the Town Center and will open in summer 2025. The 35,000-square-foot building is located at 3847 Medlock Bridge Road and will feature a rooftop event space, coffeeshop and cafe, in addition to workspaces.
An office building at 3585 Engineering Drive was demolished earlier this month to make way for a townhome community. The new 75-unit townhome project is under construction by D.R. Horton, which received rezoning approval from the city last February. The 102,000 SF office building sat vacant for many years.
Collaboration, renovation and more
Curiosity Lab announced a collaboration with Gama Sonic, a global leader in upscale, bright and durable solar lighting for homes, businesses and outdoor spaces. The company’s deployment of solar lighting in the City of Peachtree Corners marks its first deployment implementing customized, intelligent lighting programming timers that enhance safety for residents and visitors.
Brady Anderson Bennett recently opened a State Farm office at 3000 Northwoods Parkway. The 27-year-old has been working with State Farm since he was 18 years old.
Renovation is underway at 7050 Jimmy Carter Blvd. for the creation of a Planet Fitness. The gym is under development by Alder Partners/the Flynn Group. This location marks the 32nd location in metro Atlanta. It is expected to open in January.
There is also a relatively new Southern-inspired eatery you may want to try. Dahlia’s Restaurant & Porch, located inside the Hilton Atlanta Northeast hotel, opened this year. Dahlia’s offers Southern-style plates that leverage regionally sourced, farm-fresh ingredients.
Leroy Hite, founder of Cutting Edge Firewood — a luxury brand specializing in wood for fireplaces, grills, pizza ovens and firepits — shared his journey from starting a company to gaining national recognition during the PCBA Business After Hours Speaker Series in December.
Hite highlighted the industry’s disorganization and his innovative approach to firewood, including using ovens to dry the wood and improving on delivery methods. And he emphasized the importance of customer experience, branding and counter-cultural thinking.
Despite initial challenges and financial constraints at the beginning, his company grew significantly (even during the early days of COVID-19), achieving a 400% increase in sales.
Entrepreneurial spirit
The disorganization and lack of focus within the firewood industry is what initially prompted Hite to question its methods.
He thought he’d found the answer when he started a firewood company with friends while in college, winning a Kroger account for the entire Southeast. But the limited experience of Hite and his co-owners became evident quickly.
Leroy Hite at the PCBA Business After Hours event in December; photo courtesy of PCBA
“We discovered how backwards the industry was for three college students to get that account with a username and password,” he said. “On the day of the bid, whoever put in the lowest number won the account.”
With the contract in hand, the guys were able to get loans and bought hundreds of thousands of dollars’ worth of equipment that they didn’t know how to use.
“It would break every single day, so I had to teach myself how to fix it,” he said. “We hired 30 to 35 people off of Craigslist; I don’t advise you to do that.”
In the end, the guys realized they were in way over their heads. They couldn’t keep up with Kroger’s demand. But the experience gave Hite insight into a better way to deliver firewood.
“At the time, industry-wide, you would put the firewood in the back of a pickup truck, get a wheelbarrow, put it where they wanted it,” he said. “… to do a second delivery, you have to drive back and get more wood. So maybe you can do two deliveries a day.”
Hite devised a plan to have the wood palletized and use a mini skid steer, which allows you to get it closer to where it should be. What had taken 16 to 18 hours for two deliveries would now allow seven or eight deliveries in the same time frame.
After the first firewood business shut down, Hite worked with Chick-fil-A and then Enterprise Rent-A-Car for several years.
“It was great experience,” he said, though he couldn’t get firewood out of his mind.
Taking another chance
Hite considered getting back into the firewood business as a side gig, but eventually decided to leave his corporate job and pursue the business full time.
“A fire is like a beautiful sunset,” he said. “No one on earth dislikes it. A fire can be the center of a wedding party and can also add great taste to food — whether it’s steak, pizza or barbecue.”
When he started Cutting Edge, Hite wanted to fix the poor quality of wood and lack of branding and customer service.
Cutting Edge Firewood employees Diego Echevarria and Sara Bryan with Leroy Hite (center); photo courtesy of PCBA
He had an opportunity to purchase an existing business, but lacked the funding. So, he took a leap of faith.
“I had an outdated website. I had a truck, and I had a customer list. I realized I was going to be a supplier and that I needed to reinvent how to deliver firewood,” he said. “I [tried] to get a second loan on my house, [but] no banks would talk to me at the time.”
Hite convinced his wife, pregnant with their third daughter, to sell the house.
“We moved into a rental home, and I completely redid the branding. I reinvented how to do deliveries. I invented a rack that could be moved with a hand truck. And I found a hand truck that will go up and down stairs and one that will go across rough terrain,” he said. “So, the delivery went from two hours to about 15 minutes per delivery. And it was also a lot safer.”
Though COVID caused many businesses to go under, his thrived. It seemed that people stuck at home got a taste for food cooked over “fancy wood,” as he put it.
Goals and standards
Cutting Edge Firewood has two goals, Hite said: To provide unparalleled customer service and deliveries. And to provide the best firewood available. Period.
According to company literature, the Cutting Edge team “works with the best suppliers to ensure they consistently meet our high standards. All of our firewood undergoes the most rigorous drying process in the industry: each piece is conditioned for 48 hours in 250-degree heat. And our trained specialists hand-select each piece of firewood … ensuring that you only receive the very best — photoshoot-ready firewood that lights easily and burns brightly.”
photo courtesy of Peachtree Corners Business Association
Future plans
Although Hite didn’t go into detail, he sold Cutting Edge Firewood in August 2024, having built a strong brand and customer base in Atlanta and throughout the country.
“[Entrepreneurship] definitely isn’t for the faint of heart. It’s both demanding, disheartening and rewarding all at the same time,” he said. “I love it. I went in with a not-too-thin skin, but I definitely exited with very thick skin.”
Now that he’s been bitten by the entrepreneurial bug, Hite indicated that he wants to venture out again. He reflected on the challenges and rewards of running the business, including the importance of customer experience and branding.
“The brand is very, very well-known in Atlanta. We were named a couple of times in Atlanta Business Chronicle as one of the fastest growing companies,” he said. “It’s rewarding. I’ve had Coca-Cola executives say that [they] know the branding and the customer service … [and] I’m pretty sure that Cutting Edge Firewood is being used in the White House.”
Hinting of a desire to move on to new ventures, possibly focusing on disrupting existing markets rather than creating new ones, Hite again emphasized the importance of counter-cultural thinking, pushing through discomfort and being driven by a passion for customer experience and innovation.
The Peachtree Corners Business Association (PCBA) awarded a check for $500 to the United Way of Greater Atlanta (Gwinnett County) at their Business After Hours networking event in November.
The local organization was chosen by PCBA’s Outreach Committee because of their commitment to providing assistance and bettering the lives of children within the community.
United Way of Greater Atlanta
The mission of United Way of Greater Atlanta is to engage and bring together people and resources to drive sustainable and equitable improvements in the well-being of children, families and individuals in local communities.
“Greater Atlanta is one of the most vibrant regions in the country, but the region has significant barriers to realizing its potential in the future because of its continued ranking at the bottom of the list of metro areas in income mobility,” stated Vanessa Roussell, United Way senior director of corporate relations.
Vanessa Roussell, United Way of Greater Atlanta
“Children born in low-income households have only a 4% chance of getting out of poverty in their lifetime,” she continued. “We at United Way of Greater Atlanta don’t like those odds. Our work is about changing them so that children — regardless of where they’re born — have the chance to realize their potential and build lives that sustain themselves, their families and their communities.
Assessing needs within the county
The organization’s goal is to help every child unlock their full potential, by improving education, healthcare, resources and economic mobility in the communities where they live. Their “every child program” includes every child in Gwinnett.
Based on the 2023 census track for Gwinnett County, 94,308 people living in Gwinnett County are at risk, particularly in and around Sugar Hill/Buford, Duluth, Norcross, Lawrenceville, Lilburn and Snellville. The highest-need residents are located in the I-85 corridor, mainly around Duluth, Norcross and Lilburn.
Giving back to support the community
“The PCBA is proud to donate a check for $500 to United Way of Greater Atlanta (Gwinnett County),” said PCBA President, Lisa Proctor. “Our outreach committee and board are committed to supporting our community, and investing in the well-being of the children in our community aligns with our core principles. We know that our dollars will be targeted to help those at highest risk … We are glad to have the local Gwinnett chapter located right in our community.”
Funds for the PCBA Community Outreach Program are raised throughout the year from PCBA membership, sponsorship and an annual charity event. Donations and scholarships are awarded at their monthly events so that members have the opportunity to learn more about the community organizations and their programs.
Over the past 12 years, the PCBA has awarded 19 scholarships to outstanding graduating high school seniors and donated in excess of $165,500 back into the community.
About Peachtree Corners Business Association
“Where businesses come to grow,” the Peachtree Corners Business Association (PCBA) is a business membership organization that focuses on innovative approaches, programs, shared resources, community outreach and opportunities for member businesses and professionals to connect, develop, grow and prosper.
The PCBA is made up of businesses of all sizes and types who want to expand their reach and grow their business within Peachtree Corners and the greater metro Atlanta area.
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